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411 Fact or Fiction 09.08.11: Angle’s DUI, WWE Network, BFG Series Finalists, More

September 8, 2011 | Posted by Steve Cook

Hi, hello & welcome to the Wrestling Edition of 411 Fact or Fiction! I’m Steve Cook, and we are just days away from TNA’s latest PPV event, No Surrender! I know there’s the Bound For Glory Series Finals. Other than that…I honestly have no idea. I do know that Kurt Angle’s been making all sorts of noise this week & Sting will be wrestling Ric Flair on the September 15 edition of Impact. Yup. Meanwhile over in the WWE Universe, we’ve got a WWE Network to look forward to, Kevin Nash is out of a job, and the Divas are making even more noise than Kurt Angle is. Well, there’s more of them than there are of him, and I for one am thankful for that.

Joining us this week for some Fact or Fiction is everybody’s favorite ROH writer, Ari Berenstein! Yes, ROH is Ari’s obsession and I’m sure he’s excited about the debut of ROH Wrestling on the Sinclair Broadcasting stations on September 24. Wait, NYC doesn’t have an affiliate? That doesn’t make much sense.

Anywho, I’ve found a popular name from 411’s past to oppose Ari this week. You may remember him as the author of The Shimmy, a popular column here in the Wrestling Zone from 2006-2009, and nowadays you can catch him chilling on Off The Team as “Master of the…”. Making his first 411 appearance since March 2010, it’s Andy Clark! That’s right, he will not die!

  • Questions were sent out Monday.
  • Participants got this done in record time, which is much appreciated.

    1. The CM Punk/Triple H feud has lost its uniqueness.

    Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Disagree, as while this does boil down to another rebel vs. authority feud (and that’s been a boiler plate storyline in WWE for years now), Triple H and Punk have managed to keep it interesting up through this coming Night of Champions Pay Per View. Punk has some very salient points and there is still uncertainty about Triple H’s allegiances. Is he a corporate shill for Vince McMahon and Punk has been right this whole time or is there something else at play here? There is still intrigue to that plot point, though the time for answers is drawing near so that the next chapter of this story can be told. In addition, Triple H vs. CM Punk is a first-time ever match-up in wrestling history (and in some corners of the wrestling world, somewhat of a dream match) and by that very definition this scenario retains uniqueness to it. There aren’t that many high-profile first-time ever matches left in WWE these days, but this is one of them.

    Andy Clark: FACT. If there’s one thing I hate to be right about, it’s the outcome of CM Punk’s summer. Punk’s run up to Money in the Bank was an absolute thing of beauty and helped create one of the best moments of recent times, but sadly that’s all it was. Those people claiming that Punk’s promos were as meaningful as the creation of the nWo or even that Punk had moved himself to being equal with Cena and Orton on the WWE depth chart were severely misguided. With the exception of getting some swank (old) new music Punk’s “return” to WWE has become less magical every week. Coming out of SummerSlam there was hope that as Punk moved out of the WWE Championship picture there would still be something compelling and meaningful for the Second City Saint to sink his teeth into. A slow burn feud with Triple H, a war of words with Kevin Nash, and a multi-suspect conspiracy theory all had great potential. But the war of words between Punk and Nash was deflated by Nash’s inability to recapture his past glory, the conspiracy was ended this past week with perhaps the worst possible reveal, and the slow burn to a Punk-Triple H match on a big show has been rushed onto a September B-show. Shoehorning in the stipulation that Triple H would have to give up the COO position her earned only a little more than a month ago and this feud has already burned through months of material. The entire Punk situation since his return has been giant case of missed opportunity and this feud has been a key part of that.

    Score: 0 for 1

    2. Kevin Nash will remain fired by WWE.

    Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Nash may have been fired by Triple H during this week’s Monday Night Raw, but Big, Bad John Laurenitis hopped into that limo afterwards with Big Sexy. Don’t forget, as head of Talent Relations, he can hire (or rehire) anyone he chooses. Triple H can continue to go over his head and fire wrestlers he signs, but I’m sure it could become a vicious repetitive cycle in no time, especially when it come to Nash. Or maybe John re-signs Nash to a contract, with a “no termination without cause” clause built-in. Either way, this is NOT the last we’ve seen of Kevin Nash.

    Andy Clark: FICTION. I’m assuming we mean strictly in kayfabe terms. Nash will be back on WWE TV, perhaps as soon as Night of Champions. They’ve kept the storyline alive by having Nash buddy up to Johnny Ace and despite his lackluster performances on the mic on Raw, he could still be a valuable asset. Even if they do decided to write Nash out of the Punk-Triple H angle completely I think we’ll see the big man back in time for WrestleMania. I never thought I’d say this, because I believe it’s pretty widely believed that “Kevin Nash” was infinitely more successful than “Diesel,” but if you compare his return at the Royal Rumble (and the subsequent buzz that followed) with his return at SummerSlam, WWE may have made a miscalculation by not bringing him back as Big Daddy Cool. It seems silly considering there’s not a huge difference between the two incarnations of “Big Sexy,” but WWE audiences just haven’t responded to Triple H’s buddy Kevin Nash. Regardless, I believe we will see Nash back on WWE television, no matter the moniker, withing six months, if not within six days.

    Score: 1 for 2

    3. John Morrison will receive a push within the next six months.

    Ari Berenstein: FACT. Geez, Cook-erooo that’s a little vague isn’t it? A push for what-the WWE Title? The US Title? The Divas Title? A push off the roster for “an extended honeymoon” with Melina? As well, six months is a lot of time, in fact plenty of time for WWE brass to decide to push Morrison, begin his push, then decide to de-push him and then switch their minds and re-push him! Well, no matter how you define “push”, I will stipulate that WWE will push John Morrison at some point within the next six months. Though the brand consolidation could make for a squeeze play on some upper mid-carders, Morrison is exciting enough in the ring to continue to stand out and be noticed by the fans enough for him to be positioned in an important program. As well, WWE does seem to be somewhat light on strong babyfaces and could use Morrison in that role. He survived his initial burn when he returned when WWE had him lose three straight matches in a row and has been built back up since then enough to where a considerable push would be believable and effective.

    Andy Clark: FICTION. Although that depends on your definition of push. Will he win a few matches, be in a few tag team main events on Raw, and get talked up by the announcers for a few weeks? Sure. Hell, he might even find himself in title contention just in time to kill himself in a TLC Match in December. But if you are looking for a sustained, break through the glass ceiling push to the next level you best keep moving. The boat on Morrison has sadly sailed and he stands a better chance of being the next MVP in six months than the next Miz. Morrison is a textbook example of WWE’s yoyo booking and how it ultimately kills any potential a person may have. Morrison had a rocket strapped to his back in December 2010 and January of this year and look where that got him. If he was going to be pushed it would have been coming off of an injury layoff this summer and now it appears he’s further down the food chain than he was before he left. So long as he is still scrawny (by WWE standards), dating Melina, subpar on the mic, and follows the directive of WWE’s oftentimes inept creative staff Morrison will continue to spin his wheels in upper midcard purgatory.

    Score: 1 for 3

    4. Beth Phoenix & Natalya will save the Divas division.

    Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Again, the statement is vague, but I’ll forgive Cook since he’s relatively new on the job. What does it mean to “save” the Divas Division? Does it mean matches that are at least “good” if not “great”? Does it mean a kayfabe angle where they “eliminate” the weak Divas who they believe are just all beauty and no brawn or no talent? They take out Eve, Kelly Kelly and Alicia Fox one-by-one. The only way that works is if it leads to the return of Kharma as a way to balance the scales, but it’s still way too early for that to happen given her pregnancy. As to the issue of match quality, it just seems to be the case that the day of gung-ho work-rate and match quality that we saw in the women’s division from 2001 through 2006 just can’t be reached again with the current Divas roster. There isn’t someone like Trish who can go from a model (fitness in her case) to a highly competent wrestler. Kelly Kelly is trying god bless her, but I don’t think her potential tops out at the level of a Trish or Lita. Beth and Natalya are good enough to carry the division to passable matches, but not enough to “save” it in that regard.

    Andy Clark: FICTION. There’s not much saving of the Divas division to be done, and the fact that WWE has pretty much already messed up a potentially interesting storyline (the fact that they had an interesting storyline in the Divas division in the first place is astonishing) does not give me much hope for the immediate future. Beth and Natalya have already glammed it up backstage with subtle hints that they are out after the pretty girls not because they enjoy kicking ass but because they are secretly jealous. That’s not to say they couldn’t turn things around but even then I hardly see anything they do here being seen as “saving” the Divas division. The most positive thing that could come out of this is the inevitable breakup of the Divas of Doom, allowing the Glamazon and Natalya to battle it out themselves. That would likely provide some of the best Divas matches we’ve seen in some time, but at the end of the day we’ll still end up with the same Divas tag team matches we’ve seen time and time again, and DVRs nationwide will go zipping by.

    Score: 2 for 4


    SWITCH!

  • Disaster Relief for Jonas & Jen, two of many people whose lives have been changed by the Texas wildfires.

    5. You are eagerly anticipating the WWE Network’s debut in 2012.

    Andy Clark: FACT. Fact many times over. I love WWE. And I love networks devoted to entire leagues. NFL Network, MLB Network, NBA TV, even the NHL Network are all awesome because if you are fans of that particular sport you can just immerse yourself in content. WWE has so much content to fill a network, from their own library and from the libraries of companies that are long gone, that there should be something for everybody. WWE Classics on Demand has been an enjoyable venture but it has been a bit limiting in as much as getting wrestling fans excited for the product. Old school retrospectives, new school promotional tools, live and recorded events; all these things help make WWE look like a big deal. When I was a kid and there was a big WWE PPV one weekend, the various platforms WWE had at there disposal would help amp me up for the show. Staying up late the night before watching jobber matches and video recaps on Shotgun Saturday Night, reviewing the week and looking for scoops on that evening’s PPV on Sunday morning with WWF Superstars, tuning in to Sunday Night Heat to get a glimpse of the inside of the arena and check out any before the show happenings. And if I didn’t order the PPV that night I knew that flip the TV onto the Home Shopping Network at 11:00; sure I’d have to sit through some sales pitches for a Stone Cold t-shirt, but the match results and late night interviews would be interspersed throughout. Other entities, like the NFL, are able to provide that level of access, that level of hype to their events to make them larger than life. This is also a tremendous way to lure back former fans that perhaps tuned out after the Attitude Era, or even before that, and introduce them to some of the new product while they enjoy their era of choice. While WWE’s history with new ventures indicates that this network will not be on the air for long, I advise any and all wrestling fans to enjoy it while it lasts because it has the tools to be simply awesome.

    Ari Berenstein: FACT. You know, I actually felt super-pumped and excited when I saw the commercial for the WWE Network that ran on this past Monday’s Raw program. I’d like to see what WWE can do with an entire network to schedule out and implement all by themselves and for their own product. Their On Demand service has been hit-or-miss with matches but there have definitely been moments of inspiration in terms of original programming such as their roundtable features. There could be some cool ideas for other original programming and documentaries—maybe features on WWE famous venues, “Where are they Now?” type shows-heck, get Good Ol’ Jim Ross his own cooking show, bah gawd with Barbecue Sauce in every recipe! Also, I’d love to see them block out time for showing full runs of ECW television, WCW Saturday Night, Main Event and Monday Nitro, old episodes of Raw, Prime-Time Wrestling, Superstars and Wrestling Challenge as well as the other promotions for which they own the video rights, Pay Per Views and DVD documentaries. There is potential here, as long as it doesn’t become wall-to-wall WWE movie marathons of “The Marine 2” and “The Chaperone”.

    Score: 3 for 5

    6. Kurt Angle was framed by the police officers that arrested him for DUI.

    Andy Clark: FICTION. Well at least he wasn’t claiming a ghost did it. I figure by next week Angle is going to claim Dana White was responsible for the incident as payback for not signing with UFC and facing Fedor at the Tokyo Dome. The following week it’ll probably be the Russians for fear of having to deal with Angle in the Olympics. Or maybe it’s Karen Jarrett getting back at him. Oooh, the DUI happened in Virginia, Earl Hebner is from Virginia, Hebner screwed Bret Hart, ergo Hebner screwed Angle! TNA has a new t-shirt! Obviously the notion that Angle was framed by the police for his DUI (his third in a year) is laughable. Angle’s health, sanity, and lucidity seem to be in a constant state of flux and I doubt that even Angle thinks this story is going to fly, he’s just going to pull something out of his ass to see if it works. Perhaps he’s been hanging out with Hogan too much. All I know is that Angle being a star is actually his curse as TNA will shrug off the opportunity to do the right thing and make the same moves they made with Matt Hardy. Depending on whose story you believe Angle left WWE when they tried to send him to rehab and that ended up being TNA’s gain. Now, five year’s later that decision may come back to haunt Dixie Carter and company. For TNA, and mainly Angle’s, sake we can only hope the former Olympic gold medalist receives the help he needs and can take responsibility for himself instead of leaning on tired out excuses to cover up his choices.

    Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Insert Steve Austin Belly Laugh here: AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! …okay, okay, sorry… but that assertion is so ridiculous, so asinine and such flat-out bull that I couldn’t contain my laughter. I’ll try to contain myself for the rest of this answer. Yeah, the police framed Kurt Angle; I’m sure the police officers also hacked Kurt Angle’s Twitter as well. The Warren County police also orchestrated the moon landing and the JFK assassination. Look, Kurt Angle is an amazing athlete and one of the best wrestlers of the past decade, but he is also one of the most unreliable sources when it comes to statements of fact (see his comments about going to UFC) and always seems to be close to having a screw loose. I just cannot take anything he says as honest and true given previous history. Angle screwed up and he screwed up big time, while on probation for a previous drunk’n’drive no less. Then again, he was probably framed for that one too.

    Score: 4 for 6

    7. Putting Sting vs. Ric Flair on the September 15 episode of Impact is the right move.

    Andy Clark: FICTION. This is a tricky one because it’s a double edged sword. We can’t complain about TNA not pushing younger stars and focusing on the older wrestlers and then turn around and complain when a match between two of the oldest stars on the roster gets bumped from the PPV. That being said, even at their advanced ages, at one point Sting-Flair in TNA would have really meant something. Two long time rivals going at it one more time could have provided the same kind of curiosity factor the ECW reunion did in 2010. In many ways this is the exact way to use the older stars on PPV. If they’re not going to be matched up with the younger guys to get them over (and as we’ve seen with some of Sting’s PPV matches of late that may not be the best plan all the time anyhow) then they should be matched up in positions away from the World Title in special attraction matches. Sting vs. Flair may have moved the needle a bit on TNA’s abysmal PPV buyrates, except that no one wants to see Flair vs. The Joker, and even worse nobody wants to see Flair play Scott Hall to Sting’s Goldberg and just be the jobber on the way to Hogan. TNA insists on putting their legends in PPV matches that audiences have a lukewarm reaction to at best and instead give away potential money matches (like the Foley vs. Flair Last Man Standing Match) away on a show that would get a 1.2 if Jesus Christ himself returned (though TNA likely wouldn’t advertise it anyway).

    Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Yeah, this is so the right call, because lord forbid TNA tries to convince people to pay for a match they have built towards and actually seems special due to its history (Sting and Flair is one of the great wrestling rivalries of the past few decades) and the fact that Flair hasn’t wrestled in a long while. Sting has a new take on his persona, one that Flair hasn’t dealt with before and that is at least somewhat intriguing. Wrestling promotions are supposed to make people want to see a match through a build on television, then make them pay to see the match on Pay Per View. It has worked generally for WWE for 26 years now. They wouldn’t want to actually follow a historically-proven successful business model after all this time. Why start now?

    Score: 5 for 7

    8. Bully Ray, Gunner, Robert Roode & James Storm deserve to be in the BFG Series Finals.

    Andy Clark: FACT. Under the condition that we’re OK with saving Crimson from having to end his undefeated streak, these are the best four guys. As a matter of fact these four, along with Crimson, were the five guys I thought stood a chance to be standing at the end of this thing when it was first announced. For the most part TNA has really dropped the ball with the Bound for Glory Series, but I feel like they at least have the right guys there at the end. Beer Money are tremendous and while I personally like James Storm a whole lot better it seemed from the beginning that this tournament was Bobby Roode’s to lose. Bully Ray has also been the surprise breakout singles star of the year and he provides a good heel foil for the babyface tag team. I know I am in the minority, but I’m a big fan of Gunner’s, no doubt due to the homegrown nature of being familiar with his work on the independent scene. Regardless of your opinion of his workrate it’s at least refreshing to see a new face in the mix and Gunner may very well be a dark horse candidate in the whole thing (trust me, Angle vs. Gunner, if free from typical TNA booking shenanigans would be a hell of a match). For everything that TNA gets wrong I’ll at least give them credit for getting this right. [I’d also like to go on record and state that the most obvious, most TNA way to end this thing is for Roode and Storm to end up tied coming out of No Surrender and have one final match to determine the whole thing on Impact. While I’m sure the match would be great, once again I bet the September 15 Impact will be treated as a bigger deal than this $35 PPV.]

    Ari Berenstein: FACT. Absolutely, these men deserve to be in the finals, even Gunner. Yeah, I don’t like the guy much, but TNA has been dedicated to pushing him (and Crimson) as the best of the new generation of wrestlers on their roster. They may as well go the whole way with him as far as a major push. Bully Ray has been a top flight heel and has been interesting and effective in his role. I don’t know that I can buy him as TNA Champion, but final four for a tournament? Sure. Beer Money is TNA top tag team at the moment and both Roode and Storm have been consistently great in the ring—not to mention one of the few things TNA hasn’t royally screwed up all these years. Either one of them could be a pretty good choice to challenge for the major title, though Storm may have a (legit, non-Samoa Joe inflicted) serious injury that could keep him out of action for awhile.

    Final Score: 6 for 8

    Ari & Andy set a new record for the Cook Regime, agreeing six out of eight times! Thanks to both men for participating, and we thank you for reading and want to hear what you have to say! For Ari Berenstein and Andy Clark, this is Steve Cook saying join us next week for more Wrestling Fact or Fiction!

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