Ask 411 Wrestling 07.03.13: Vince Selling WWE, Attitude Era, Brock Lesnar, More

My first edition of Ask 411 Wrestling went just as I suspected. Surprisingly enough, my second edition of Ask 411 Wrestling also went just as I suspected. That may seem strange to some, but it’s not. Love me or hate, I will be honest. Would you rather I lie and make up an opinion I don’t believe in? That is just doing a disservice to my readers. Honesty is the best policy, right?

Most of the questions sent my way were opinion based, so that is the direction we’re headed. Remember, I am do not pick the subjects – YOU DO! The link is posted at the bottom of the page for my email address. If you do not want to participate, that is up to you. For those of you that have been, I thank you. Until then, make sure ALL of you stay tuned until the (near) end of this column. A surprise is coming! Get ready.

BANNER!

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Backtalking

Nothing of note. Lots of opinions – not a ton of factual evidence though…

Your Turn, Smart Guy…

Last week’s question was about the last promoted match between Bret Hart and The Undertaker. Funnily enough, many thought it was easy…only to get it wrong. The first correct answer came to us from SHADE45 in the comment section! Props to you. It was the 900th episode of Raw during the summer of 2010. Both Kane and The Nexus interfered right as it began. This week, let’s try something a tad different.

Since April 2010, how many pay-per-view matches has Triple H won?

Questions, Questions, Who’s Got The Questions?

We start out with Connor asking about everybody’s favorite announcer!

What are your views on Tony Schiavone? Do you think he was one of the great announcers or was he lame and as bad as Bobby Heenan and Gene Okerlund said in interviews, about him being a politician and hiding finishes from them?

I think he was the greatest in the history of professional wrestling!

Okay, just kidding.

I didn’t mind him but also wouldn’t go out of my way to pay attention when he talks. My best comparison for modern day wrestling fans is Josh Matthews. He is not terrible; he also is not amazing either. When the man needs to fill in, he does a good job. When there is an opening, give him the chair. However, when there is a huge spot or match to be called, he won’t be anywhere close to that big of a stage. Good announcer, nothing special really.

The stuff about Bobby Heenan and Mean Gene is just your typical garbage in wrestling. It is the tired ‘he said, she said’ drama. In this case, it is actually ‘he said, he said.’ There are tales of Heenan and Okerlund not exactly caring about WCW once their giant paychecks arrived. Ask Mark Madden about those stories! He will happily tell you about the pre-show happenings. I am sure they were against Tony and vice versa. We saw a similar situation in TNA recently. Some young buck announcer (Todd Keneley) came in out of nowhere. Taz and Mike Tenay berated him on air and shut him down at every turn. Months later, Keneley was shown the door out of the company. You don’t think politics played a role or the two vets were threatened? To be replaced perhaps? Thus, naturally, the two sides were not going to get along from the get go.

Not to repeat myself from last week, but EVERY single person plays favorites (politics). Some do it in different ways. However, it is all the same. If you can help out your buddy instead of someone you don’t like or have never met, you will help out your buddy. In every walk of life/profession, that is the same. You, me, all of us would do it if given the chance.

We keep rolling with a question from Damion about MONEY:

Do you think Vince McMahon would ever sell WWE for any price? Like if Bill Gates offered 5 billion cash, or does Vince love WWE too much?

First, I would question what the heck Bill Gates is doing purchasing WWE…

Decades ago, I may have answered this differently. Now that Vince is pretty close to retiring (even though he never officially will), I don’t see the point. It is not like the man is single and in his 30’s. A couple billion dollars to thrown around? Plenty of years left in his youthful self? Yeah, that would be intriguing. Now that he is clearly wrapping things up and handing the reigns over to Triple H and Stephanie, what is the point? Also, you mentioned it. Five billion dollars is a lot of cash, but Vince loves wrestling. Despite all the jokes and stuff about ‘entertainment’ these days, it still comes down to wrestling. I think Vince wants that to continue on with his family and not let Bill Gates (or anybody) else get involved.

Readers: What do you think? Would Vince sell the company for FIVE BILLION DOLLARS?!?!

Let’s switch gears and go to a topic from two weeks ago…in this very column.

Much Ado About Skittles talks about percentages in winning a title:

I think the asker simply wanted you to determine how many distinct holders there have been of a title (for example, 70 intercontinental champions), divided by the number of performers (presumably male, despite Chyna’s title and Beth Phoenix’ title match) that have ever been in the company. One part of the question is rather easy: how many people have held each title? The tougher parts of that answer might be what to consider of a single person who has held a title under different gimmicks; and the fact that managers and non-performers have held titles on occasion.

However, I can see where you run into a much more difficult spot. Even if you could find how many people have ever been a WWF/WWE wrestler, other than the WWE/WWE title, the other titles haven’t always existed, and how do you deal with the fact that someone’s odds were legitimately 0% if the title didn’t exist during their career? Maybe you could figure this out using only the 43 men who have held the title.

There you go! Good luck to anybody daring to try that out. Now to an actual question…

Someone asked you this week about how USA network feels about the app covering the match during commercials. Credit here goes to my friend, who said at one point that if WWE really wants to cement the need for people having the app, they need to have a title change on the app. I’d first even like to see a match end during the commercial, but it really would set quite the precedent if the US or Tag Titles were swapped during a commercial. Do you think this idea is viable and would result in a massive download (following a brief outrage from those watching only the show)?

I don’t own the WWE App. Therefore, my thoughts may be a little bit more skewed for those that do care about the thing. In my mind, that just mirrors a similar strategy with WWE pay-per-view preshows. Yeah, you can do ‘big’ stuff on there, but it is really limited to your audience. Even doing Sheamus vs. Damien Sandow for the Payback pre-show felt out of place. In the past, WWE has changed a title or two during a pre-show. That is fine to draw attention, but it does send the wrong message. On top of that, I just said it. Such a small portion of your audience will see it anyways, despite WWE trying to convince you otherwise.

Back to the WWE App, somebody actually emailed me that exact idea a few weeks ago (before I took over Ask 411 Wrestling). Finishing a match during commercial? A title change on an app? Are you insane? That was my original belief. Since then though, I have come around. If WWE really wanted to do it and shake things up, do it once. ONCE! Like you mentioned, there would be an outrage over the decision, but when is there NOT an outrage…over anything really? Somebody is always complaining or whining about something going on. I think doing it for ‘shock’ value would increase traffic instantly but then die down afterwards. You just can’t do that kind of thing often…

Up next: The Wyatt Family is on the mind of DAndre:

Simple question. Where do you think the inspiration for the Bray Wyatt character comes from? I kind of get a Max Cady-ish feel from him. I hope the WWE utilizes him correctly.

I don’t know.

…

Oh, you wanted some more?

Well, rumor has it Dusty Rhodes came up with the gimmick. We all know how trustworthy those reports can be! Your comparison works for now. Bray Wyatt has yet to actually appear live on Raw (or Smackdown). Thus, it is probably best to just remain patient. His work in FCW or on NXT is one thing. However, we have seen before that making the ‘main stage’ is a whole different story. Just because something works during short vignettes or in front of a Florida audience, that does not guarantee you success in WWE.

Adam wants to discuss the WWE Hall of Fame and potential inductees!

With the Hall of Fame now done for another year, this seems like a good time to ask about 10 wrestlers and whether you feel they are likely to make the HoF or if they deserve it.

10) Vince McMahon, there’s no doubt he deserves to go in, but do you think he will ever go in while still alive or will we have to wait for a posthumous induction?

Okay, let’s knock these out one by one…

1. Ivan will go in. Just off memory, I just assumed he was already inducted. Guess not. There is no right ‘time’ for him to get his induction, so WWE can pick their spot here.

2. Stan Stansky? The man who Ryback crushed on Raw? Oh, oh, oh you mean..okay, gotcha! My fist instinct is to say no. His big title win was clearly just something transitional.

3. I suppose Terry Funk could go in again. It just sets a dangerous precedent with guys going in twice! You do not want to do that too often. if the WWE Hall of Fame is not watered down enough as it is, that will certainly do the trick.

4. Yeah, Heyman will go in. This has been discussed before. Being in NY/NJ in 2013, it seemed fitting this year. Guess not!

5. I could back and forth with Chyna. She was incredibly popular at one point but so was Zack Ryder, so that doesn’t always mean much. The Ninth Wonder of the World will get inducted one day, but like Scott Hall and Jake Roberts, they will have to be clean for a LONG extended period of time. Not just a few months before the ceremony.

6. The Honky Tonk Man will get his day in the spotlight. He backed out before because a different commitment would have made him MORE money than the Hall. While I find it hard to believe, he has a family to feed. If that was best for him at the time, he had to do it.

7. I assume British Bulldog gets inducted. Like Ivan, there really is not ‘time’ to give him the accolade. WrestleMania is not headed overseas and COULD be held in Canada one day. Save Bulldog for down the road…

8. Eh. Marty? Hall of Fame? My fist reaction was no. He did have a ‘good’ career. However, that is like saying Kofi Kingston should go in the WWE Hall of Fame. Being ‘good’ in the mid-card is fine, but does it deserve a Hall of Fame spot? Close call.

9. Sean Waltman will probably be find a spot with DX or nWo (as a group). You could add in Chyna for the DX induction. On his own, the man always came through (read above). I am just struggling to imagine him going in by myself.

10. Vince McMahon hardly wants to be mentioned or even seen during the ceremony. This year (and a few other instances) were the exception. Look for the boss to be inducted FAR down the road, not anytime soon.

Brock Lesnar is the next topic of discussion, thanks to Matt:

I was just a simple fan, and wasn’t a part of the IWC, around the time that Brock Lesnar was having his first run in the WWE.

What was the general reaction to everyone when he first arrived, and did that change much during his initial run? How was he (and the booking of him) generally perceived?

It is funny.

I was JUST watching the King of the Ring 2002 pay-per-view. Do not ask why. Keep in mind Brock Lesnar had debuted three months earlier, destroying a bunch of guys and The Hardy Boyz at back to back PPV events. No “real” feud though. Brock Lesnar’s entrance for his first match against Test at King of the Ring drew minimal crowd reaction. Very little. Very quickly into the match, ‘boring’ chants started up, as well as ‘Goldberg’ chants. Oops! Now, you know how Ryback feels nowadays. Obviously, Test did not have a lot of fan support that night, nor did Lesnar. It was rough.

His second match of the KOTR tournament was against Rob Van Dam. This was a short match but more of the same. People cared about the huge moves but nothing else. Paul Heyman did his best at ringside. The finish woke everybody up, as the Next Big Thing was the new King of the Ring! For the months prior, just think of Ryback. Tons of ‘Goldberg’ chants, some ‘ECW” chants, and a sporadic flurry of ‘boring’ chants. Imagine that? Wrestling fans not very accepting of someone new? Never would have guessed!

I think the turning point came when he just kept winning – same with Ryback. At some point, fans stopped with the sarcastic taunting and realized he wasn’t going away. Feuding with RVD certainly helped. Squaring off with The Rock definitely put him over huge. Being undefeated and fighting for the WWE Undisputed Title told viewers he was major and not some flash in the pan. Whether it was Heyman, his in-ring work, working with top stars or just deflated acceptance, Brock won the people over. By the time he fought Big Show in Madison Square Garden, he had the fan support on HIS side and was a full fledged main eventer. he had nothing to worry about during 2003 and the beginning of 2004 (then he left).

My best word to sum up the reaction towards him during that initial 2002 run was ‘skepticism.’ That is only fair. His name had been circulated through their training facility (and in dark matches for awhile), so the guy was not a total unknown. However, once he showed up on WWE TV and started plowing through guys, people were curious. Was he legitimate? Could this guy actually perform? What was Heyman doing at ringside? Is this monster the real deal? I hate to keep using the comparison, but just think of Ryback in 2012. That was Lesnar in 2002. Some live crowds REALLY gave it to him and mocked his matches. Others enjoyed the act and chanted along with him. For one reason or another, WWE stuck with it. Persistence paid off.

Omar brings up an ‘old school’ topic for all the long-time readers:

When Manny Fernandez jumped off the top rope on Invader 3, was that just a wrestling story line or was it real?

Ah, yes. Here is the video questioned:

There have been varying stories on this particular incident. Just by watching it all unfold though, this SCREAM “wrestling story line” to me. The move was done. A referee is quickly yelling to stop. He does it again, despite the warning. Out of the blue, you can see a locker room full of guys rush to the ring! Then the victim lies there coughing up blood, as the attacker runs off. Seems like a well played angle. Usually, the simple ‘eye test’ works best. When watching it, does everything LOOK planned? Was there any indecision or awkward pauses in between? Did people act differently? I’m sure many will argue up and down that this was a SHOOT BROTHER! The same people will also tell you the Montreal Screwjob was planned and Elvis Presley was at the mall yesterday.

We have a hypothetical question from Christopher about The Ultimate Warrior!

Hypothetical question here regarding Warrior’s disastrous 98 WCW run: Conventional wisdom says he was brought in for the sole purpose of getting Hogan his win back from WM VI, which he did then disappeared. However, what if he’d really gotten over? Let’s say the crowd was positively molten for the guy, chanting his name throughout the show and whatnot, until even the monkeys booking the show at the time could see that the logical, money-making move would be to put him over Hogan clean on the way to a titanic mega-showdown with Goldberg. Of course, this is assuming the guy is behaving responsibly and professionally at the time, as well. Was the locker room so dysfunctional that Hogan’s ego would still have taken precedence, or is there any way they could have changed courses and done the right thing?

Fair question.

I’m not sure his sole purpose of coming to WCW was so Hulk Hogan could defeat him. That seems a little too ‘smarkish’ for my taste. However. once he did arrive, I’m The Hulkster was grinning from ear to ear. He beat Warrior in their disastrous match, and it was clear the best move was to just move on. Now, had things gone better and exploded like the you mentioned? It is tough to say. When dealing with WCW, you can’t trust the ‘monkeys in the back’ to make the right decisions. When that is added on with Hulk Hogan, you certainly can’t count on that. Fifteen years later, he is positioned as the top star in TNA Impact Wrestling despite barreling being able to walk! When you combine, Hogan, WCW, Bischoff, and ALL the other factors, Warrior probably did not stand much of a chance. Even if he did take over and draw huge money, it would only be short-term.

Changing topics, Jon asks about a short Chris Jericho-World Title win!

Last week’s Raw put this thought into my head: Jericho is still way over; he’s the best currently working at putting guys over, and he just beat the World Champ on TV. How about one final title run for Jericho leading to a face vs. tweener feud with Ziggler with Dolph winning the title? Jericho gets a well deserved couple of months with the belt, and Dolph wins the title the right way from the right guy.

No reason to. Jericho has been made it VERY clear for the past three years he does not care about titles, main events and/or ‘wins’ anymore. His time is over with worrying about that kind of stuff. That has been no mystery to anybody paying attention. His mission is to return, ‘put over’ guys and deliver great matches. Isn’t that what folks want in part-timers and legends? Help the next generation? Or do the rules change when he is one of your favorites? Then he should win and headlines shows? Jericho has many other projects going on in his life. Anything ‘extra’ for WWE is wonderful All of this comes down a recent interview Jericho did with Ring Rust Radio earlier this year. Here is a direct quote when asked if he has been underutilized in his career:

“I guess six-time World Champion, nine-time Intercontinental Champion, first Undisputed Champion, I guess all that stuff is being held back; is being a jobber. Then yes, I totally agree with them. I don’t know what you want me to say. I’m Y2J, man. I’ve been doing this for 22 years at the top level. I don’t understand fans sometimes. Six-time world champion, I don’t know how you can deny that. Obviously, at some point I got something right?”

That about sums it up. It makes no sense to me.. He has done everything imaginable in WWE, and could get more? Ridiculous. What would a ‘pity’ World Title run do for him in 2013? Nothing. A similar situation came up with CM Punk in January 2013. The man just came off a 14 month run as WWE Champion, became the longest reigning champ in decades, won tons of big matches on pay-per-view (most clean), and had the time of his life with Paul Heyman. The moment he loses to The Rock at the Royal Rumble? What do some say? ‘STUPID! WWE HATES PUNK! BURIED!!! PEOPLE’S ELBOW BEATS HIM!! HOW DARE HE LOSE! WAHHHH!’ I just don’t get that mindset. Outside of being WWE and World Champion for the next 10 years straight, beating The Undertaker at WrestleMania, pinning Brock Lesnar and Triple H clean, headlining every single show, and getting 20 minutes of promo time every night, nothing is good enough…

*STRONG LANGUAGE USED IN VIDEO*

Today, we close things with a little bit of a treat for all of you. Last week, Ryan Ingram asked about why Chuck Taylor has never made the jump to bigger and better things. Well, I reached out to him personally and asked that direct question. Thus, this answer came straight from the horses’ mouth, so to speak. Here is Chuck Taylor speaking on why he (Chuck Taylor) never made it to bigger and better things:

“Because he’s an awful wrestler.”

My Darn Opinion

Can we all simply move past the Attitude Era?

Maybe it is just me, but I am long past the late 1990’s. At last check, it is 2013. There is no WCW Nitro. ECW TV on Friday nights is gone. There is no ‘war’ each Monday night. Bra and Panty matches no longer have any ‘stimulation’ for fans in this day and age. Go take a quick Google search for 5 seconds if you really need to. Seeing blood in each segment and Jim Ross screaming at the top of his lungs every night is not something I want to re-live. I’ve watched wrestling for over 20 years and loved that time period as much as the next person. Trust me, it was great! However, life goes on.

Do fans just forget the garbage we saw? Are our childhood/teen wrestling memories just covering up for all the bad stuff? Choppy choppy with Val Venis? Mae Young and Mark Henry? Road Warrior falling off the stage? The Corporate Ministry stable with seemingly 50 members? Vince McMahon winning the Royal Rumble and then the TOP TITLE months later? Swerves and story lines with no logic whatsoever? Main events featuring run-ins and ref bumps at every turn? Wasn’t there over 10 WWE Title changes in 1999 alone? The Oddities? I could go on and on.

I just wonder sometimes. If all of those moments occurred in 2013, would we be so forgiving? I just watched an Attitude Era PPV I own. It ended after 2 hours and 35 minutes, but was scheduled for three hours like all the rest that year. Can you imagine the outrage if a WWE PPV in 2013 closed with 25 minutes remaining? Yet, not a word was said…because it was the Attitude Era. If there was a dozen World Title changes in 2014, how would YOU react? if Vince won the Rumble next year, how would that go over? Or a big Corporate Ministry moment – let’s say John Cena was revealed as the leader of The Shield (or Nexus) all along? Zero basis – just a pointless swerve to ‘trick’ fans. Would it be remembered fondly in 15 years through rose colored glasses or bashed relentlessly for being ridiculous?

Think about it.

Self-Promoting Finale

Now, let’s get some “ME!” plugs out there…

Justin Watry on Twitter!
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